Nationality - a poll for Brits

[ladyofastolat]

This is a poll just for people from Britain. Sorry, everyone else!

Having nothing pressing to do tonight, I decided to say "yes" when the BBC website asked me if I had a few minutes to evaluate the bit of it I was on. The survey went on to ask me what my nationality was, offering me a list of options that included "British" as well as "English," "Scottish", "Welsh" etc. It made me wonder how many people would select the country-specific answer, and how many would go for the general. I would imagine that English people are more likely to select "British" than Scottish people are, at any rate.

[Poll #1611063]

(This all reminds me of the chap who filled in our library user survey, and in the ethnic origin section, disdained the "white - English" option, and angrily wrote "I'm white Anglo-Saxon (not on list!)"

EDIT: Curses. I just accidentally voted as Pellinor, who is currently in a wet field in Yorkshire and nowhere near a computer. Since I seem to use the laptop for LJ a lot more than he does, perhaps I ought to change the LJ login manager to default to my login, not his.

Comments

[squonk79.livejournal.com]

I say English, because i'm not Scottish or Welsh as far as i know!

And i've always had a horrible feeling that Britain really is just England plus two countries we bullied into it.

[ladyofastolat.livejournal.com]

When I was young, the difference betwen English and British was drilled into me very hard. My Dad gets quite cross when English people use "British" when they actually mean "English," and vice versa - a mistake that I doubt many Scottish or Welsh people make. I once spent a good while attempting to explain to some people at work why a book on Henry VIII was English history and therefore classed under 942, whereas a book on the reign of Queen Victoria was British history and classed as 941. They couldn't understand the difference.

[kargicq.livejournal.com]

I am also thoroughly confused as to when Britain/British does or doesn't include Northern Ireland. It depends entirely on context, it seems.

[ladyofastolat.livejournal.com]

Indeed. I dithered for a while about whether to include "Irish" in my poll. I'd initially excluded it, since I thought that it was "the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland," which implies that Northern Ireland isn't part of Britain. And then there is of course all the politics involved, by which some people in Northern Ireland would doubtless proudly declare themselves to be British, whereas others would furiously deny it. I decided to evade the issue by confining myself to England, Scotland and Wales, and hope that no-one shouted at me for missing out Northern Ireland.

[lil-shepherd.livejournal.com]

Great Britain is the main island, the British Isles includes Ireland and all the smaller island, geographically speaking. Northern Ireland is therefore part of the British Isles (as is the Republic!) but not of Great Britain.

Edit: and British, as a Nationality, includes people who are citizens of the dependencies, though not the Commonwealth. That is why the people of Gibraltar talk about 'remaining British'.

[philmophlegm.livejournal.com]

Yes, that's my understanding. The United Kingdom of Great Britain was formed by the Acts of Union of 1707, but Ireland was kept subordinate. After the Act of Union with Ireland in 1800, the combined kingdom was the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland. And then of course most of the Irish buggered off in 1922, leaving the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland. I have argued at work that JOLF UK should actually call itself JOLF GB since the Belfast office is actually part of the Irish firm. Nobody agreed with me.

There was never an equivalent 'Act of Union' (i.e. passed in both parliaments) with Wales since Wales was simply conquered by England. Welsh law still applied for some time after the conquest until Henry VIII formally annexed Wales. Someone who was Welsh was (at least constitutionally) English since Wales was part of England. This was clarified by the Wales and berwick Act of 1746 which made it clear that 'England' included Wales (and also Berwick-upon-Tweed). The constitutional status of Wales has been muddied by recent developments like the Welsh Assembly.

[lil-shepherd.livejournal.com]

Thanks - I wasn't as clear on the Welsh bit as I suppose I should be.

[kargicq.livejournal.com]

I wonder if the Northern Irish get upset about the fact that the UK's Olympic Team is called "Team GB" rather than "Team UK"? And why is that, anyway?

[ladyofastolat.livejournal.com]

Talking of Berwick, I noticed when we were there a few months ago that although it's in England, its football team plays in the Scottish league, and that the regiment that used to be based there was a Scottish one. So Wales isn't the only complicated place around. ;-)

[kargicq.livejournal.com]

Re your edit: Interesting. I don't think that many Channel Islanders would self-identify as British, even though they definitely have British Nationality!

[philmophlegm.livejournal.com]

If you think that's complicated, don't try to get into the question of whether Cornwall is part of England or not.

[lil-shepherd.livejournal.com]

You're talking to someone who once lived in the area where, if you came up the motorway, you passed signs ( not official!) saying, "You are now entering the Socialist Republic of South Yorkshire."